MOBILE USERS: m.isthmus.com
Connect with Isthmus on Twitter · Facebook · Flickr · Newsletters 
Wednesday, April 23, 2014 |  Madison, WI: 47.0° F  Light Rain
Collapse Photo Bar

Help Divest Madison from Fossil Fuels

Please limit discussion in this area to local and state politics.

Help Divest Madison from Fossil Fuels

Postby cme_charm » Thu Apr 11, 2013 5:06 pm

The most urgent and important issue of our time is climate change and finding a solution immediately. There are solutions, but we are still addicted to environmentally devastating fossil fuels. Big Oil continues to be subsidized by the Federal government, so we need to build a movement on the local level and rise up.

Please help Madison reach the minimum of 100 signatures needed to send a petition to Madison Aldermen/women to divest Madison from fossil fuels within 2 years. This petition is part of the Fossil Fuel Resistance movement. You will not be asked for money or sent any e-mails, except a "Thank You for Signing- Please Share".

Please sign the petition! Click on the link to be directed to it:

http://campaigns.gofossilfree.org/p/divest-madison

Check out 350.org and the article published in the current issue of Rolling Stone magazine for more details on the Fossil Fuel Resistance. Thank you so much.

Catherine
cme_charm
Member
 
Posts: 1
Joined: Thu Apr 11, 2013 4:58 pm

Re: Help Divest Madison from Fossil Fuels

Postby The One » Mon Apr 15, 2013 5:10 pm

No, I'm great with fossil fuels. Thanks.
The One
Senior Member
 
Posts: 64
Joined: Thu Oct 20, 2011 4:45 pm

Re: Help Divest Madison from Fossil Fuels

Postby gargantua » Mon Apr 15, 2013 9:36 pm

Well, at least we'll no longer be bothered by things like buses and garbage trucks. What are they supposed to run on, meat?
gargantua
Forum God/Goddess
 
Posts: 3850
Joined: Sat Apr 13, 2002 1:30 pm
Location: Madison

Re: Help Divest Madison from Fossil Fuels

Postby Sandi » Mon Apr 15, 2013 10:27 pm

Unless you want to go nuclear, a fossil fuel free Madison, ( or any city for that matter ), is a pipe dream.

A fossil fuel free Madison would starve, not to mention freeze to death in the winters.
Sandi
Forum God/Goddess
 
Posts: 1235
Joined: Sun Jul 17, 2005 11:31 pm

Re: Help Divest Madison from Fossil Fuels

Postby Stu Levitan » Tue Apr 16, 2013 12:14 am

C'mon, people, the call is to "divest," not stop using. Here's the statement:

Madison should immediately freeze any new investments in fossil fuels, and divest from direct ownership and any commingled funds that include fossil fuel public equities and corporate bonds within 2 years.

So, now that you know ... discuss.
Stu Levitan
Forum God/Goddess
 
Posts: 3183
Joined: Sat Feb 08, 2003 8:40 pm
Location: Studio B of the historic Abernathy Building

Re: Help Divest Madison from Fossil Fuels

Postby Sandi » Tue Apr 16, 2013 7:44 am

No thanks. That would be a feel good exercise, with no practical impact.

But then I don't live in Madison ( thank god ) anyhow.
Sandi
Forum God/Goddess
 
Posts: 1235
Joined: Sun Jul 17, 2005 11:31 pm

Re: Help Divest Madison from Fossil Fuels

Postby wack wack » Tue Apr 16, 2013 8:08 am

Any fuel source other than wind or sun is ultimately a losing proposition; the sooner we arrive at that understanding, the better.
wack wack
Forum God/Goddess
 
Posts: 3007
Joined: Mon Jan 20, 2003 5:32 pm

Re: Help Divest Madison from Fossil Fuels

Postby Galoot » Tue Apr 16, 2013 8:25 am

I tend to agree, but it's pretty tough to fly airplanes or run trains and trucks on wind or solar power.

Of course, once peak oil effects hit within the next decade or so, only the very rich will be flying anywhere.
Galoot
Forum God/Goddess
 
Posts: 1450
Joined: Thu Jun 14, 2001 1:10 pm

Re: Help Divest Madison from Fossil Fuels

Postby snoqueen » Tue Apr 16, 2013 8:28 am

Funny how a particular sector of our contributors can't define "divest" and immediately choose to scorn and ridicule what they can't understand. That says something.

Whether it does any good or not, divestiture is an established practice. The UW has been asked to divest itself of companies using sweatshop labor to make fan gear, and once divested itself of South African investments during that country's apartheid era. Many other examples can be offered.

Making a statement isn't a totally stupid act, and the results can't always be measured in dollars. Persons and groups with various political viewpoints make statements in symbolic form all the time, if you think about it.

I'm interested in how bio-generation of fuel, not only methane but also more sophisticated fuels, may become possible in the relatively near future. On the other hand, I'd add generation of electricity on a scale sufficient to serve heavy industry as unlikely to be served by solar in the near future. And I hope I'm wrong.
snoqueen
Forum God/Goddess
 
Posts: 10969
Joined: Fri Feb 14, 2003 11:42 pm

Re: Help Divest Madison from Fossil Fuels

Postby wack wack » Tue Apr 16, 2013 8:30 am

Galoot wrote:I tend to agree, but it's pretty tough to fly airplanes or run trains and trucks on wind or solar power.

Of course, once peak oil effects hit within the next decade or so, only the very rich will be flying anywhere.


And it will forever remain tough as long as we act as if money is the end and not a means to better things. The only reason we don't develop these "alternative" fuels is cost.

The end of humanity will come not from a space-based catastrophe or some Biblical reckoning, but from its own short-sightedness.
wack wack
Forum God/Goddess
 
Posts: 3007
Joined: Mon Jan 20, 2003 5:32 pm

Re: Help Divest Madison from Fossil Fuels

Postby Leroy Gates » Tue Apr 16, 2013 10:39 am

wack wack wrote: The only reason we don't develop these "alternative" fuels is cost.


What a coincidence, cost is the only reason I'm not driving a Lamborghini.
Leroy Gates
Forum Addict
 
Posts: 162
Joined: Mon Feb 11, 2013 11:09 pm

Re: Help Divest Madison from Fossil Fuels

Postby wack wack » Tue Apr 16, 2013 10:50 am

Leroy Gates wrote:
wack wack wrote: The only reason we don't develop these "alternative" fuels is cost.


What a coincidence, cost is the only reason I'm not driving a Lamborghini.


If driving a Lamborghini was your priority, you'd make it happen.
wack wack
Forum God/Goddess
 
Posts: 3007
Joined: Mon Jan 20, 2003 5:32 pm

Re: Help Divest Madison from Fossil Fuels

Postby gargantua » Tue Apr 16, 2013 10:53 am

Sandi wrote:But then I don't live in Madison ( thank god ) anyhow.


Trust me, you're not the only one who is grateful for that!
gargantua
Forum God/Goddess
 
Posts: 3850
Joined: Sat Apr 13, 2002 1:30 pm
Location: Madison

Re: Help Divest Madison from Fossil Fuels

Postby Galoot » Tue Apr 16, 2013 11:08 am

wack and others, I certainly agree that we would have done much more good by spending a trillion dollars on alternative energy research, instead of the horrible Iraq invasion.

But as I have pointed out previously, fossil fuels are an incredibly dense and inexpensive source of energy. One gallon of gas has 135 million joules of energy available. And even at $5, it is practically free.

There have been no breakthroughs in physics since the first nuclear pile was made, that provide any insight as to find an energy source that is so cheap and easy to use. I wish we could conserve what we have and use it sparingly, instead of wasting it all over the next 40 years.

But we aren't going to find some rock or nut or tree that will provide that kind of energy density--that amount of energy, 135 MJ per gallon, is easy to spot.

There have been two very promising technologies developed over the last 10 years or so, but both companies went out of business. One was making something like heating oil from turkey offal, down in Missouri. The other was making solar energy units that used Stirling closed-cycle engines, and that company was achieving 40% efficiency with their units. They had installed quite a few out in the Mojave, they were supplying electricity, then they went bust.

Note that 40% is higher efficiency than any solar cells except laboratory prototypes, by a LONG shot.

I think when oil gets to $400/bbl, the turkey guts process will be competitive again and can be revived.

But we will never again have $1 a gallon gasoline, much less $1 for a gallon of an alternative fuel that is so energy dense.
Galoot
Forum God/Goddess
 
Posts: 1450
Joined: Thu Jun 14, 2001 1:10 pm

Re: Help Divest Madison from Fossil Fuels

Postby Henry Vilas » Tue Apr 16, 2013 11:18 am

While this won't work in Madison (warm tropical waters are needed), this might be viewed as a breakthrough:

Lockheed to build 10-megawatt thermal power plant off southern China
Henry Vilas
Forum God/Goddess
 
Posts: 19166
Joined: Wed Sep 04, 2002 8:57 pm
Location: Name sez it all

Next

Return to Local Politics & Government

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests

moviesmusiceats
Select a Movie
Select a Theater


FacebookcommentsViewedForum
  ISTHMUS FLICKR

Promotions Contact us Privacy Policy Jobs Newsletters RSS
Collapse Photo Bar