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Paterno: Why he should coach forever

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Re: Paterno: Why he should coach forever

Postby Huckleby » Sun Jul 22, 2012 11:37 am

Detritus wrote:The statue is gone, and the NCAA will announce penalties on Monday.


I watched an interview with Tavis Smiley & the President of NCAA, Mark Emmert.
http://video.pbs.org/video/2257100910/

That guy is impressive! Very thoughtful. Either he is a super-salesman who has me snowed, or a man of high integrity. He certainly sounds open to imposing severe penalties.

If the NCAA really does announce penalties so quickly, I have to believe they are shutting down football for a period. God, I hope so. We'll see.

I have to believe that public momentun is building towards a pause in Penn State football. The cheering football crowds in just a month, with the legal battles continuing to be in the news, would be unseemly.
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Re: Paterno: Why he should coach forever

Postby Huckleby » Sun Jul 22, 2012 11:43 am

http://espn.go.com/college-football/sto ... ource-says

Strike my last post from the record.

That weasle is going to allow football to be played this fall. I don't give a damn about "severe punishment" that keeps the old circus in town.

Terrible, terrible terrible. The problem is swept under the carpet, allowing the "Joe was railroaded" crowd to live long and prosper.

Money triumphs over doing the right thing.
Last edited by Huckleby on Sun Jul 22, 2012 11:44 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Paterno: Why he should coach forever

Postby O.J. » Sun Jul 22, 2012 11:44 am

The Ped State football program won't be getting the death penalty, unfortunately, but penalties that have been described as "unprecedented" and possibly having a greater long-term impact on the program than cancellation. Expect bowl bans, bans on television, loss of scholarships and massive fines.
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Re: Paterno: Why he should coach forever

Postby Huckleby » Sun Jul 22, 2012 11:47 am

O.J. wrote: Expect bowl bans, bans on television, loss of scholarships and massive fines.


This shit accomplishes NOTHING.

In fact, it is the worst of possibilities.

The Penn State faithful will nurture a sense of victimization - and frankly they have a point, these sanctions target the current football program.

What matters is the symbolism. Continuing to play football allows the fans to party-on with the same old attitudes.

Terrible, terrible outcome. I'd prefer that they did nothing.
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Re: Paterno: Why he should coach forever

Postby O.J. » Sun Jul 22, 2012 12:03 pm

Huckleby wrote:
O.J. wrote: Expect bowl bans, bans on television, loss of scholarships and massive fines.


This shit accomplishes NOTHING.

In fact, it is the worst of possibilities.

The Penn State faithful will nurture a sense of victimization - and frankly they have a point, these sanctions target the current football program.

What matters is the symbolism. Continuing to play football allows the fans to party-on with the same old attitudes.

Terrible, terrible outcome. I'd prefer that they did nothing.


If they did nothing, it would just further the delusional notion of Penn St fans that this investigation was nothing more than a witch hunt. Do you honestly believe that, for example, a restitution fund set up for the victims, financed through fines levied on Penn State, would accomplish NOTHING?
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Re: Paterno: Why he should coach forever

Postby Huckleby » Sun Jul 22, 2012 12:12 pm

O.J. wrote: Do you honestly believe that, for example, a restitution fund set up for the victims, financed through fines levied on Penn State, would accomplish NOTHING?


Such a fund is a public relations farce.

Penn State is already going to be drained by civil litigation by the victims. An official fund would just be a way to make it all look altruistic and voluntary.
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Re: Paterno: Why he should coach forever

Postby Huckleby » Sun Jul 22, 2012 12:17 pm

O.J. wrote: If they did nothing, it would just further the delusional notion of Penn St fans that this investigation was nothing more than a witch hunt.


I understand this perspective.

Anything the NCAA does will be criticized in some way.

By treating the incident with sanctions that resemble other, sillier scandals, the NCAA is telegraphing that the football atmosphere at Penn State was not essential to the problem. That is WORST possible message.

The circus starts right back up.

A one-year suspension of the program, was the bare minimum symbolism needed to send message that problem was broad and cultural.
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Re: Paterno: Why he should coach forever

Postby O.J. » Sun Jul 22, 2012 12:20 pm

You honestly believe that, absent the death penalty, the most appropriate action to take against Penn St is to do absolutely nothing?

From what I gather, these sanctions will be harshest ever levied on a football program, save SMU. We'll find out tomorrow.
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Re: Paterno: Why he should coach forever

Postby Huckleby » Sun Jul 22, 2012 12:25 pm

O.J. wrote:You honestly believe that, absent the death penalty, the most appropriate action to take against Penn St is to do absolutely nothing?


Yes. If the NCAA is not prepared to suffer the financial hit of losing Penn State football for a year, just honestly declare they aren't getting involved under banner of lack of jurisdiction.

O.J. wrote: these sanctions will be harshest ever levied on a football program, save SMU.

Uhhh, big whup. Those "severe sanctions" are a joke, they really don't change what Penn State was facing under existing situation.

I'm depressed over this cowardly outcome. I guess I got my hopes up by the dignified presentation of the NCAA president, who evidently is a master weasle.
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Re: Paterno: Why he should coach forever

Postby Comrade » Sun Jul 22, 2012 1:54 pm

I am not objective about this at all, but what I would like to see is Penn State expelled from the big 10.

I don't think they belong in this conference.

I also don't expect this to happen.

Seriously, would like to see Penn State presented a petition signed by representatives from every other school in the conference. The petition should state how they feel that Penn State does not live up to acedemic, athletic, and most importantly MORAL standards of the conference. They would therefore no longer be welcome or accepted.

What they did harms the entire conference, and ALL the other schools should take a stand against this.
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Re: Paterno: Why he should coach forever

Postby Igor » Sun Jul 22, 2012 2:16 pm

Believe me, I have read plenty of ridiculous pro-Paterno supporters, including the guy who said "unless I see JoePa doing something wrong on videotape, I am assuming he was innocent". Interestingly, those same idiots tend to want to string up absolutely everyone else involved.

But I also am willing to let the justice system get more of the information out in the open first. I don't see how the appropriate punishment (however severe) doled out 8 or 9 months from now is somehow worse than the "best guess" punishment done right away. When the trials are over for the PSU admins involved, much more evidence and testimony will be on the record. Freeh didn't get to interview a lot of the main players in this farce since he had no subpoena power. Whatever the released e-mails hint at, I think that there will be testimony that is 20 times more damning once we learn about various meetings and discussions held during that timeframe.

As to the symbolism / message that is sent by football continuing - worrying about symbolism and messages is what caused this issue to go on for so long in the first place. The emphasis should be on doing the right thing, not just doing *anything*.
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Re: Paterno: Why he should coach forever

Postby Huckleby » Sun Jul 22, 2012 3:12 pm

Igor wrote:But I also am willing to let the justice system get more of the information out in the open first. I don't see how the appropriate punishment (however severe) doled out 8 or 9 months from now is somehow worse than the "best guess" punishment done right away.


What sort of investigation do you expect the NCAA has conducted in the past to determine sanctions? I expect the Freeh report is 10x more thorough and objective than any other NCAA effort.

What can more civil and criminal trials determine? Perhaps some details about individual culpability, but there will be much disagreement. From the NCAA's point of view, the settled fact is that there was massive institutional malfeasance.

The legal process is not going to shed any more light on the big picture. There is a need to get resolution before the season starts out of fairness to the many innocent parties who will be hurt by sanctions - athletes, vendors, etc.
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Re: Paterno: Why he should coach forever

Postby O.J. » Sun Jul 22, 2012 4:54 pm

Comrade wrote: The petition should state how they feel that Penn State does not live up to acedemic... standards .


Priceless. While I would have absolutely no problem expelling PSU from the Big Ten on moral standards alone, I've never heard that they don't live up to the academic requirements of the conference. Is this another example of my "naivitee?"
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Re: Paterno: Why he should coach forever

Postby Comrade » Sun Jul 22, 2012 6:57 pm

I always thought they were kind of weak in that area. Of course some departments are better than others. There was talk amongst us at the UW about how they were only competitive in athletics, but I admit it was only talk.

I just think it would send a clear message to Penn State and the rest of the world if the entire conference collectively stood up an refused to play in that stadium as if nothing had ever happened. It might go a long way to bringing about real change.
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Re: Paterno: Why he should coach forever

Postby O.J. » Mon Jul 23, 2012 8:14 am

http://espn.go.com/college-football/sto ... ating-1998

No death penalty, but a heckuva lot better than doing nothing.
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